Given the amount of police and prisons in the United States, why is there still so much crime and what does that say about the effectiveness, or lack thereof, of policing and incarceration? Andrew Krinks, author of White Property, Black Trespass: Racial Capitalism and the Religious Function of Mass Criminalization, joins us to discuss the reasons police and prisons exist and if they actually make the country safer. What role does religion play in America’s system of criminalization? What are the racial disparities in the criminal justice system? And, what types of things should be established that might do a better job at preventing crime that would also create a more equitable society for everyone?